Curse

X Joey X · Aug 05, 2008, 06:29 AM // 06:29

Quote:

I don't think it's quite like that.

I think it's hard for players, who have devoted a lot of time and energy into earning something, see another player who only had to do 1/2 the work or less.

I've grinded out all of the eotn and both ss/lb titles and I'd like this. Mainly cause I cbb to grind it all again for my other chars and cause getting my war r12 SY without having to hfff is sexy :P

Gill Halendt · Aug 05, 2008, 07:53 AM // 07:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thizzle

It's supposed to be about fun not spending hours grinding to get the max rank.

I can't see the "fun" factor in maxing a rep title to have PvE skill working better anyway.

I have lots of fun with all of my 11 characters and only my main has maxed all the rep titles in the game and my favourite secondary just got LB/SS. My mesmer runs Cry of Pain sometimes, and he's just Sunspear Castellan. Sure, he could deal more damage with it with higher ranks in the Sunspear title track, but he's no less fun to play.

You know... I'd really love to get a 60" plasma TV set. Shame I have a family and my monthly wage has more urgent destinations than this. Sure, I can afford it if I save a little here and there, do a little sacrifice... And maybe some tedious overtime @ work. I want it, I work for it. Otherwise the standard CRT 32" TV I own is more than enough for watching DVDs.

There's a difference between necessity and wish. GW is not about grinding, people made it so by giving more relevance to titles than fun. As fas as I know, GW can be played wonderfully even without any single maxed title. PuGs don't accept players with non-max Norn title? Fine with me, that's not a group I'd like to play with anyway. You don't really believe they're going to have fun, do you? They're just hoarding virtual money clearing elite areas with mindless skills. Find groups of people who actually play for fun, if there is any left. Then your skillbar and your titles won't matter that much anymore.

The fact you can grind your titles, farm insane amounts of money and get cool looking stuff for your characters doesn't mean you must do it.

Hyper.nl · Aug 05, 2008, 08:35 AM // 08:35

/notsigned

Because it is too easy / lazy. You are supposed to do SOMETHING for those skills to be efficient, not just playing through the storyline in NM.

Accursed · Aug 05, 2008, 11:57 AM // 11:57

/signed - It would make the titles alot easier to obtain.

kostolomac · Aug 05, 2008, 12:29 PM // 12:29

It seems people misunderstood me.
I never said that the title will progress with the storyline , you can still grind them titles all you want. The skills in question wouldn't be tied to the title , but to the progress with that faction.
Also , a special attribute for pve skills is a nice idea also.

Gill Halendt · Aug 05, 2008, 02:17 PM // 14:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by kostolomac

I never said that the title will progress with the storyline , you can still grind them titles all you want. The skills in question wouldn't be tied to the title , but to the progress with that faction.

That could have worked when PvE only skills actually had something to do with the storyline - so, when PvE only skills where just three: Lightbringer's Gaze, Lightbringer Signet and Sunspear Rebirth Signet -. Fine, I'd say, I've fought my way up to Abaddon's Gate serving those Lightbringers, my Lightbringer's Gaze is now stronger than ever against him. Mmmkay, that could do.

Then came those sometimes ridicolously overpowered skills. Sunspear, Norn, Asura, Vanguard, Deldrimor and the likes. Basically, you're suggesting max skills after just completing the whole storyline. So, I should have max skills with most of my characters, since almost all of them have gone through Nightfall and Eye Of The North. Max Ursan without even that little effort is needed now...

No, thanks, that's plain ridicolous, unless PvE only skill are toned down considerably, or allowed only in their respective areas.

romeus petrus · Aug 05, 2008, 02:34 PM // 14:34

Im all for anything that would remove the rewards for grinding. Linking massively overpowered skills to title grinding never made sense to me. If you like to grind for some lame line under your name, feel free to grind till you drop. Just dont let it affect gameplay.

/signed

Thizzle · Aug 05, 2008, 03:07 PM // 15:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper.nl

/notsigned

Because it is too easy / lazy. You are supposed to do SOMETHING for those skills to be efficient, not just playing through the storyline in NM.

Too easy... What's too easy? Going through a campaign you already beat to fill some book nobody cares about up with memoirs? They should just make it go through the storyline is rank 5 and giving you a rank when you complete a main part then going through the storyline in hard mode will add up to 5 more ranks.

MithranArkanere · Aug 05, 2008, 03:12 PM // 15:12

Finish the campaign and you automatically get the max Normal rank. Finish the Campaign in hard mode and you get the max HM rank.

That way people would be able to:
- Grind to get the title: Your reward is having an advantage that makes playing easier.
- Play without the advantage: Your reward is getting the title.

Makes perfect sense to me.

Kattar · Aug 05, 2008, 03:14 PM // 15:14

Wow...I really like this. Like...I don't even know what to say.

I don't necessarily care about making the titles easier to obtain - you should have to grind those if you want. But as far as power increases within the titles go, this is a completely valid idea.

/signed x1000

kazi_saki · Aug 05, 2008, 03:22 PM // 15:22

/signed. It makes sense anyways. It's not about the hardness or whatever since its just there for fun

Tyla · Aug 05, 2008, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gill Halendt

PvE skills are actually tied to titles.

And the titles are grind.

Quote:

You don't have to grind any of the titles to play the game, nor it's mandatory to use any of the PvE skills to do it.

The point is they still give benefits. If it was cosmetic I wouldn't be as spiteful to this sort of thing.

Quote:

The best effectiveness of a PvE skill is a bonus rewarded for the extra work implied by improving/maxing the title. Even if it's just "grind", is something you have to work for to get the best out of it. Don't mind maxing the title? PvE skills still work fine, even at lower ranks in their respective title tracks.

Grind is against the original vision, and when grind has benefits you are infact restricted from certain things.

Quote:

Standard skills usually work better at higher levels of their attributes. Yet, you don't ever have to use superior runes to use them preperly.

The difference is these title related skills have no negative impact.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hyper.nl

/notsigned

Because it is too easy / lazy. You are supposed to do SOMETHING for those skills to be efficient, not just playing through the storyline in NM.

Grind was never hard in the first place.

Abedeus · Aug 05, 2008, 05:31 PM // 17:31

Less grind more pew pew

/signed

glacialphoenix · Aug 05, 2008, 05:34 PM // 17:34

Less grind please.

/signed.

MisterB · Aug 05, 2008, 05:35 PM // 17:35

I'd like to see attribute points added for the title tracks, with increased levels in the title having a rune-like effect. The ranges for the PvE skills would probably need an adjustment. As an example of what I mean, you could spend attribute points for your Norn title up to 12 like your regular attributes, and rank 10 would grant +3 like a superior rune.

I like the OP's idea as well; I'll support any method to divorce the PvE skills from grinding titles.

VinnyRidira · Aug 05, 2008, 09:46 PM // 21:46

/signed

Grinding to get better skills is like levelling up past 20.

dragonx1013 · Aug 05, 2008, 10:15 PM // 22:15

Either way, people who want to max out the titles will do so. I personally do not because as I have stated in other posts, I do not like to repeat the same actions over, and over, and over again (also known as farming). I have done so many UB runs, it makes my eyes bleed to see olafstead.

With that said, I think it is a good idea to tie the skills to completion of the campaign. I would leave it to ANet to decide at what level does it become powerful, I would say each mission gives you +1 level, then each mission in hard mode gives you +1 level. The missing levels could be given when you complete all the side quests.

Consider though what could the bounties offer? They would be removed from the game and that is a drastic change to the game system. People like the idea of bounties, and if you remember, you can always grab them when you go out questing. You also get a generous rep boost for trading in hero's handbooks, and that's kina like a mutated version of what we are talking about. (finish the game and get points. And after a certain amount of points you can do it in hardmode). Whichever path the player chooses is their own, if a player wants to grind then let them. I prefer the story way, to me, much less boring.

Because of the boost from handbook's, and the removal of bounties (and editing of some quests too) seeing as how they would be useless...

/Unsigned

Cathode_Reborn · Aug 05, 2008, 10:31 PM // 22:31

Less grind and more play? In GW? This is madness!

/signed

Gill Halendt · Aug 06, 2008, 07:09 AM // 07:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyla

The point is they still give benefits. If it was cosmetic I wouldn't be as spiteful to this sort of thing.

An OPTIONAL benefit, in exchange of the time spent grinding the title.

I mean, don't get me wrong, I like the idea of removing the link between titles and PvE-only skills. As said, grinding is against the game concept and is way too boring.

But then, PvE-only skill must be toned down accordingly, max skills should not be that powerful. Getting better skills while progressing in the storyline is fine and makes perfect sense for me too, I just don't see any single reason why imba skills should come for free for just beating the game in a few hours.

Please, don't be hypocrite. People have been bashing PvE-skills and UB everyday. This idea cheapens those skills even more, you're basically asking to have the equivalent of a max Pain Inverter or Ursan Blessing without doing even the simplest task you've been asked up to now, even if boring.

Tyla · Aug 06, 2008, 07:17 AM // 07:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gill Halendt

An OPTIONAL benefit, in exchange of the time spent grinding the title.

It is still a benefit empowered by time spent. Whether or not it is optional is besides the point.

Quote:

Please, don't be hypocrite. People have been bashing PvE-skills and UB everyday. This idea cheapens those skills even more, you're basically asking to have the equivalent of a max Pain Inverter or Ursan Blessing without doing even the simplest task you've been asked up to now, even if boring.

How am I being hypocritical?

How does this "cheapen" those skills when you can simple do the same thing over and over with ease? Grind has never been hard, and just because it reduces the amount of grind needed to join PuGs or gain additional benefits powered on grind wouldn't make these skills "cheap", they would just be easier to gain a max advantage of.